I still haven't found a valid argument for why a voter isn't held responsible for the actions of representatives. Especially if the actions would be likely to occur.

Let’s throw that all away because learning is liberal.

I want to note that when Brexit happened EU citizens had about 2 years period to move to UK and just like that get their full rights there and those with enough years of stay had the right to obtain British citizenship. Streamlined process through scanning your id using an app, little to no hassle.

IIRC half of the EU citizens left despite having all those rights and streamlined bureaucracy. My observation was that those desperate or those who ware having their perfect life stayed, those who had other options left UK because it wasn't worth the stress and you future being bargaining chips for politicians.

I bet you, if this continues for some more time USA will no longer receive the best and the brightest. Those have options and their parents will prefer the options where their golden kids don't risk being subject to life changing actions or even abuse.

(/s in case it wasn't obvious)

Makes me think of:

"Reality has a well known liberal bias" - Stephen Colbert

The amount of "burn it all down because I don't like the people that like this thing" is depressing.

> In a news release, the Department of Homeland Security sent a stark message to Harvard’s international students: “This means Harvard can no longer enroll foreign students, and existing foreign students must transfer or lose their legal status.”

I didn't expect to see Harvard getting smacked around or humiliated like this.

Between Harvard, Yale, and possibly a few other schools, I thought they had influence throughout government. And that key figures in government were interested in maintaining and benefiting from that influence.

And a lot of that influence seemed aligned with national interests. (For example, getting things done with prestige connections, domestically and internationally. And the international diplomatic goodwill, when children of the world's wealthy and powerful go to prestigious schools in the US.)

Is some other faction at work now, or is it the same people as before? Are the power networks changing? If the distribution of power is changing, is it partly due to someone willing to sacrifice national power from which all parties benefited (and everyone else wasn't expecting that, or wasn't ready to defend against that from within)? Better questions?

A regular corporation with the same fact pattern of discrimination would be looking at a billion+ dollar fine.

this is just Harvard losing some special privilges and being expected to act reasonably fairly like any other publicly funded institution.

https://substack.com/home/post/p-163976813

They're not actually so scientifically productive that we should tolerate discrimination in order to get the fruits of their research.

Does ICE just have full discretion over SEVP? Can they do this to any school for whatever reason they want?

[0] https://www.dhs.gov/news/2025/05/22/harvard-university-loses...

[1] https://www.dhs.gov/publication/dhsicepia-001-student-exchan...

It will quietly be done, although likely in a way that make it look as if Harvard hasn't.

Look how China is dealing with Trump. Trump announces tariffs, China returns Boeing planes, tariffs somehow comes down.

Vance literally defended the eating cats and dogs lie during the debate. The entire fucking point of this platform is to fuck the immigrants, legal or otherwise.

Or is this actually a surprise to anyone with half a brain?

The Democrats continue to try to stoke outrage about events and conditions that, quite frankly, no one gives a shit about. They've lost the plot. Meanwhile, I've just learned that suppressors are likely to become legalized here in the coming months. It's a small thing, of course, but that's net positive in my book.

That being said, republicans decided to chose an M1 Abrams tank to kill the pesky mice in the system.

This is more like the latter. There aren't many signs of us hitting the bottom thus far.

It's crazy they're punishing tons of students who don't even have anything to do with these protests

     does it own the libs?      N ---> dont do it

             Y
             |
             |
             v
           DO IT !

They might prefer to start with certain targets, but all international students are target of opportunity, the same way they've attacked all sorts of law-abiding legal immigrants. [0]

[0] Though perhaps with some very particular and suspicious quasi-ethnic exceptions. https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/crljn5046epo

So people committing thought crimes huh?

This is the US in 2025 - indefinitely imprisoning people without any actual charges for having opinions the current administration doesn't like.

The courts have been beaten months ago. We are well into crazy train territory.

Will the people who had to transfer or leave be made whole? Even if a judge overturns this it will take time that the students impacted by this will have to pay, regardless of outcome.

> In a news release, the Department of Homeland Security sent a stark message to Harvard’s international students: “This means Harvard can no longer enroll foreign students, and existing foreign students must transfer or lose their legal status.”

So DHS revoked the visas for all existing students at Harvard? That doesn't seem quite possible?

Doesn't give them a timeline either.

The best and the brightest from around the world will prioritize top universities at other countries, and this will damage one of the US' biggest attractions and advantages.

Unbelievable.

They will be accommodated.

https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2025/5/23/trump-admin-rev...

https://x.com/DKThomp/status/1925631602589151325#m

For a physics PhD for instance at Cornell you usually get paid to teach your first two years and if all goes right do your actual research on a grant. In my case the prof had written a grant for the work I wanted to do which didn't get funded, I spent a summer thinking about the problem which helped us come back with a great grant proposal that got funded.

I know Masters of Engineering students pay their own way, maybe other departments are different. I remember there being a lot of Chinese graduate students 25 years ago but now I see lots of undergrads.

Who's selling that policy?

edit: looks like they started this in 2017! https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2018/11/29/university-il...

That's some forward thinking!

In the last three months, we've collected many data points which are each each further down a slope. I suggest the slope is slippery, and has a very unfortunate end.

__________

[Edit] Predicting a future that might resonate more with YC folks: "Pursuant to Trump Executive Order XYZ, you must submit regular firewall logs and social-media handles for activity by your staff. Failure to comply will result in losing the ability to post H1-B positions."

damn, Trump is really gunning for Harvard

not sure what rolling over for Trump looks like, but a lot of existing foreign students will be screwed unless something gives

From a similar CNN article:

"Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem ordered her department to terminate Harvard’s Student and Exchange Visitor Program certification, making good on a promise made last month when she demanded the university hand over detailed records on its international students’ “illegal and violent activities” before April 30 or face the loss of its certification."

Okay, who could they possibly be talking about? Right. The Gaza protesters.

Miriam Adelson - $150m donated to Trump, second highest

Elon Musk is not the only one that bought the White House. So there is a genocide that if any of us tech people had some courage we could easily make some pretty wild visualizations of the before/after of Gaza maps, and the current full scale ethnic cleansing of it, but we can't bring it up. We're failing as tech people on this, but so is the whole world.

They’re trying to hit some targets for deportation numbers and shipping home “criminal” foreign students is an easy win.

They're targeting everyone they can find. Russian refugees (https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/11/science/russian-scientist...), Danish people who missed a form (https://www.mississippifreepress.org/ice-arrests-mississippi...), etc.

So it's not really about Gaza, Palestinians, or Jews. It's about control.